What Is That?

Father, you are so patient, so kind, and so loving, my heart leaps for joy in discovering daily how I delight You!

Rich

Truth

Nicole, you've opened a whole can of worms here with your questions, and I'm loving it!
I asked my wife for her input regarding what you wrote in response to my piece I wrote, so the following are her thoughts and I will be adding mine later. I want to say that I am in agreement though with what she has said here.

I am in no way saying the following is the gospel truth; it’s just how I see things.

I think that anything that presents itself as ‘truth’ outside of knowing the Lord is merely an illusion, much like how Neo abruptly realized that his prior life was not the ‘real’ reality. The truth is that all of humankind was ‘born in sin and shaped in iniquity’. Our outlook on life has been distorted from birth because it’s based on lies; the scriptures state unequivocally that the entire world lies in the power of the evil one. It’s only when we come to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ that we begin to question what we had once so firmly believed to be true. But even then, there are degrees and limitations to the extent of ‘truth’ one is willing to perceive.

I think that our choices don’t necessarily define our reality but they do play a role in how much truth we eventually see. For example, several times in my life I’ve accepted ‘the red pill’. I knew the Lord would not love me any less had I taken the blue pill, but if I had I knew I would have missed out on God’s best. Choosing the red pill has resulted in much pain, suffering and sorrow, but I know without a doubt I would never have come to know the Lord the way I do today otherwise. Consider the folk who are content to sit in a pew. It’s a comfortable, familiar place – for them. Maybe at some point in their lives they were offered a red pill and turned it down, preferring to live a life with as little drama as possible. There’s no doubt they’re born again, but the ‘truth’ they see is limited to the secure confines of their safe little world.

On the other hand, there are others who are willing to have their eyes opened no matter what the cost. As was the case with Neo, this process is extremely painful. Why? It’s because the enemy of our soul does not want us to know the truth, and he will do his diabolical utmost to keep us blind and in bondage. The problem is, we don’t have eyes to see how he’s twisted and perverted our thinking.

I think that the bottom line is that truth is available to anyone willing to receive it…and not everyone is.

Margo/Rich

Living out Loud

My Response To Pete

I thought because of the length of this, I would reply with a separate post regarding Pete’s question/s comments when I put this blog entry up.
Pete's thoughts etc. are in white, mine are in green.

I had listened to Darin on the God Journey podcast and I have friends who are very much part of Darin's Free Believer's Network, who encouraged me to look at the site and listen to some of the podcasts. The first thing I noticed on the home page was the introductory SERMON and the request for donations of $20 or more. That was two red flags!

Pete, All I know is that our heavenly Father has always made himself available to those seeking Him for Himself. I love how in Luke it says of Jesus, he sent the full away empty, but the empty, he sent away full! Not sure how that ties in here, but it is the truth just the same then as it is now.

I guess what I am pondering is, is my life, the life of the Father in us, as us, is it creating a hunger to want Him, to know Him without any unnecessary props? Are we more concerned in making others disciples of my/our opinions than of Him?
It seems that there is this mentality that has a firm grip on the hull of our thinking much like the barnacles on a ship, that if there is indeed a genuine hunger that has been birthed in the life of an individual then I must be that special someone they must have in their life in order to accurately hear Papa for their continued walk in grace. Is this the Truth?


BUT I did look at several articles and listened to a couple of podcasts. Some of the material is excellent but ...

I expressed my concern to another friend who pointed out that Darin was still giving sermons and that it seemed to him as if Darin was on a journey but hadn't yet had the courage to really step out of the box.

As I mentioned on my blog , Father has wonderfully enriched me personally through things he has written, on his pod casts etc, but I no longer see anyone especially those who are looked upon or on as being someone special. I kissed way to much ass in my former days playing the game within churchianity.

I am in the process of reading Wayne Jacobsen’s book, The Naked Church, and although in the very start of it I am seeing things he shared back more than 10 years ago being MOST relevant to some of what I have expressed in my thoughts re: this blog entry as well as in my reponse back to you.
By the way, before I forget, there was something you posted on a blog somewhere not sure where a line/phrase you said you had heard once that goes something like this; “I don’t really know what I think, until I have spoken it out loud.” I probably have misquoted you, but I loved that.
So in saying that even now in my pondering and sending this on to you, I too am learning, discovering much about what I really think, by voicing my thoughts out loud.
I love this part from Wayne’s book, and I intend to use this in a letter I'm forwarding to a good friend that has recently contacted me.

“Anyone who does not gush with admiration for church institutions and activities today is accused of being arrogant, rebellious, or judgemental. That’s our modern equivalent of being stupid or unfit. So, even though our Christian experience feels empty, we think we’re the only ones to feel that way. To admit this is unthinkable, so we rationalize those nagging thoughts that tell us this can’t really be what God had in mind. After all, there is always more to be gained by exploiting a system than there is by exposing it.”

We could both see that Darin had a lot to offer primarily younger people, who were beginning their journey outside of traditional Churchianity.

Pete, in my opinion, NONE of US has ANYTHING to offer anyone apart from Christ in us as us, period!! We are all placed in our journey of discovering at different times we are both students and teachers.
We are all being discipled by Christ Himself through His spirit working in and through each of us.

But this raised another question. How would we answer someone who suggested that had an elitist attitude?

Great question Pete; I love the story in Acts where it talks about a brother, an ‘Apostle’’ named Apollos who was an ’eloquent’ man, and he was mighty in the ‘Scriptures’. (Acts 18:24-28) This man had been instructed in the way of the Lord. He was according to the Scriptures speaking fervently in spirit, teaching accurately the things concerning Jesus, being acquainted only with the baptism of John, none the less spoke out boldly in the synagogue.
But, it says, and this is the heart beat of my response to your question; Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him aside and explained to him the way of God more ACCURATELY!

In my opinion when one sees them self being as a ‘someone-body’ as in, who do you think you are trying to tell me, don’t you know who I AM!
I am NOT saying this is how Darin sees himself, all I know is the church was fortunate back then that Apollos didn’t get all puffed up on who he was, but in fact a very real spirit of humility seemed to set the stage in his life in receiving a greater revelation of who this Christ was/is through what has often been referred to as ‘lay people.’
These two ‘lay people’ were fellow workers, colleagues with Paul himself.

I believe we miss so much in being puffed up vs. Being established and built up out His love 4 us ALL. It says in the Scriptures that the whole body is to be built up as a result of speaking the truth in love to each and every member. Our reliance is on one man, the man Christ Jesus as our only mediator between the Father and us!

I NO longer see any heroes, great men of God, but slowly as the eyes of my heart are being opened, I am SEEING the greatness of Him, our Papa in all that have been received of the Father.

We all NEED to see, especially those who might feel a bit superior to those ordinary garden variety type believers that He continues to oppose the proud, but graces the humble.
We are in great need of His grace and truth to NO LONGER recognize-know anyone after the flesh! Until this becomes the norm within the church, the cast systems will reign even outside ‘the box.’

And for the record, if I was able to sit down with Darin I would lovingly and calmly speak my heart to him expressing his need for me as much as my need for him, no more or less!!!

Rich

The simple answer is that I can't. I know the journey I have been on - outside the box to some extent for about 40 years - and how my thoughts and beliefs have changed gradually in that time.

Any thoughts?

Where Are You Now

I want to conduct an inquiry here especially directed toward those who have been heavily involved in the Charismatic back ground and now, are either ‘outside the box’ of institutional organized religion or you’re some place else.

My inquiry has to do with this; those of you who were visible and vocal with regards to the prophetic, preaching, teaching, worship leading-leader/s, whatever, where are you now that you have NO outlet for your specific ‘gifting/s, calling, anointing, ministry?’
Where and what is your identity now apart from the holy place, holy huddle, with the holy folks?

I hope to be enlightened here if I’m wrong, but from what I can see especially with those who have been heavily involved within the Charismatic stuff, e.g. the Vineyard and others, folks are either, POW’s, statistics-casualties of the war, simply settling into some form or expression of religion or have come to know and experience Life totally apart from the religious land of Oz.

Also I am aware of those trying to reinvent the religious wheel of ‘church’ only trying so very hard not to call it that if possible. Please hear me I am not judging anyone; this is but an observation on my part.

Another thing I’m going to throw in here is this. What’s with those, the ones many of us have looked up to as viable ‘leaders’ who likewise came to a crash and burn reality and encountered the God of Grace, and then slowly walked away from this personal sobering grace wakeup call, and established yet another ministry (identity) only this time its based upon the ‘truth’ of grace verses law?
I find it amazing how this encounter with the grace of God can, like anything else be turned into a means of promoting self and profiting big time by it!

I know I’m drifting away from my original question, but hey, let’s go along for the ride.

If I were to ask one of these folks who have turned grace into a (their) new ministry-calling how and why they did so, I think I might get this kind of explanation. How could this not be of God, just look at the many, many, many cards and letters and emails and on and on that I get in response to what the Lord has spoken through me, ‘my ministry-pod cast-books-my-my-my-! I guess one can’t argue with cold hard facts, or can one?

With the fresh and sobering news leaking out from the Lakeland Florida-Todd Bentley thing, it is very easy to see how as Brad Cummings said on a recent pod cast, ‘It’s not the wickedness of my heart that alarms me as much as it is the ability to be deceived by my own thinking, rationalizing.’On a blog I was led to, I posted this comment regarding the author’s comments revolving around the Lakeland/Bentley issue.

“The carnage continues and will continue as long as we choose to drink the holy 'Kool-Aid’ offered by the angel of light himself. The kicker is that the enemy of our soul is powerless until we give a mind to him. I share this as one who has been resurrected from the dead, one of John Arnott’s former assistant pastors.

It is truly amazing how we allow ourselves to be deceived through the deceitfulness of our own hearts. Father loves us too much to violate us, to force us to choose life verses death, and yet it takes a death to witness His power to turn that which was intended for evil, into the Good only He can bring out of it.

Here is something I want to say as well. If we persist in going our own way the Father will allow us to do so. He will allow us to live with the consequences of those actions. The demonstration of the Father’s love in these situations is not in getting us out of them but in what He does with them. There is no one who can get so much good out of a lousy situation as God can. The Father allows us to experience the consequences of our follies but He is also right there with us in them.”

I look forward to any who wish to respond to my inquiries,
Rich